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This accent on proper education turned up everywhere. Godfrey Mokgogane, Pitje, the doyen of black lawyers, spoke of it in extenso. I asked him whether it was difficult for black students to become lawyers. ‘It used to be,’ said attorney Pitje. ‘It's better now. Today, it's more a question of finance, whereas there was a time when there were restrictions on blacks entering the universities. Now, it's easier, in the sense that there are now also black universities that are especially for them. There has also been a relaxation on entering requirements for black students into white universities. I think, at present, most of the white universities in South Africa would accommodate black students.’
I asked him whether he had children. ‘Yes, my son Legwai Pitje has been now at the Bar for eight years and thus is the longest-serving of black advocates. The Johannesburg Bar is the largest in the country and has 381 practising members. Six of these are blacks. The number will soon double, because another 6 pupil advocates are in training. So, my son is the oldest black advocate in Johannesburg,’ he said with pride in his voice. ‘Are you worried about your children's future?’ I asked Pitje: ‘Yes, naturally I am worried, with things as they are. But, at the same time, when I look back at the past, when I was young, I have to be optimistic and feel that freedom is at last perhaps around the corner.’ ‘And not by means of a bloody war?’ I asked. ‘Hopefully not. Nevertheless a bloody confrontation between blacks and whites should not be excluded as a possibility. As much as our government attacks outside interference by the United States, Great Britain or Holland, and so on, I do think that it makes a difference what the outside world thinks and does. I also think that the government is going to release Nelson Mandela, and in part they will do this as a result of pressures from the outside.’
‘Are you then also in favour of the boycott and disinvestment?’ was my next query. ‘Yes, I am,’ said attorney Pitje. ‘Do you feel also that Royal Dutch Shell should leave South Africa?’ ‘Yes, I do,’ answered this one-time colleague and friend of Nelson Mandela and Oliver Tambo. ‘For a long time,’ he said, ‘Holland was closely associated with South Africa, because our original settlers were from your country. But, the South African government, by its own actions, caused the present rift between this country and Holland.’
I do not often make a speech when I am interviewing, but here I inter-